Shops & Pubs of East Dulwich Remembered

            Follets Music Shop, 5 Lordship Lane, East Dulwich, S.E 22

Folletts Music Shop in the early 1960s. This is Mr Bawcutt (the owner)Folletts Music Shop in the early 1960s. Mr Bawcutt (the owner)

Above photo, courtesy & copyright of Denise Vennard

Thank you for your help Denise.

5 Lordship Lane5 Lordship Lane (2)


Crystal Palace Tavern

Old CPT bar

Old CPT snug

The Old Snug Bar

I understand it the pub’s exterior has remained fairly unchanged from how you would remember it, apart from the addition of a patio style raised seating area with picnic benches that stretches around the outside of the pub on Crystal Palace Road and Underhill Road. When the pub changed to be called the CPT this was added and was then redone and neatened up a little when it became its current incarnation.

Some of the older regulars have told me there was at some point a small shop selling crisps, cigarettes etc… where the current main door on Underhill Road is. That’s now gone of course and what I’ve been led to believe used to be some of the many entrances to the pub are now shut off and just windows. There are still three entrances in use, one that leads into the “snug” area where the toilets are, the main one I mentioned with the two doors leading to either the “saloon” or “lounge” and one in the middle of the side of the pub that faces Crystal Palace Road.

The bar itself was moved to its current position along the back wall for the opening of The Great Exhibition in March 2012. The ale pump are all original and play up as much as you would expect for ones that old! Behind the bar we still have the mirrored patterned glass and the curved piece which I imagine used to be around one of the pillars in the centre of the pub. A lot of the furniture is still the same, in fact we had one man who said what he remembers as the dominoes table (long and thin with cast iron feet) is still there and has a part time use as a DJ table!

The pub now has a kitchen and what we call the “Gin Yard” which are in the back of the pub where there didn’t used to be anything as far as I know apart from possibly the back entrance to the quarters on the upper levels. This was all cleared out, a door allowing access from the pub put in and wooden porch decking and a covered area put in for smokers.

As far as I’m aware quite a lot of the old features remain so you may recognise some bits and pieces from the pictures although I imagine it looks quite different from when you remember it.                                                                                 Freddie Harris




IMG_4962 IMG_4963These photos are courtesy of Freddie Harris, The Great Exhibition (Crystal Palace Tavern) 2014

The Crystal Palace Tavern used to run a Christmas Loan Club, you would pay so much in each week, ten bob (50p) or £1.00, as much as you could afford and then get it back with interest at Christmas, that was very handy, that would have been around 1969/1970, there was also a Piano where regulars could have a good old singalong, the couple who run the Pub at that time were Michael & Gloria, don’t know their surname, but they were very nice, the Pub also had its own Off License, that was situated facing Underhill Road, kids were allowed to go in there and buy Smiths Crisps, R Whites Lemonade, Peanuts etc, good old times.                                                                                                John Chinery

 The Crystal Palace Tavern prior to any modern make overs.

This is George Cooper, licensee of the CPT, on the left, but not sure who the other person is, possibly a barman. This was taken in the bar of the CPT.  George was born 1886.

This was taken outside the Crystal Palace Tavern (to use it’s then name) and has the then owners name on the pub (Burtwell) I assume around the 1920’s or 30’s.    

George Cooper again on the left with a barman and on the right a member of the Freathy family, George’s wife Caroline family name.  George and Caroline were very popular in the area.

Another one of George Cooper sitting in the yard  of the CPT next to what used to be the stables and during the war became an Air Raid Warden station.

Taken outside the Tavern with George Cooper, Caroline Cooper then Annie Freathy.  No names for the two on the right.

Photos & Information by kind permission & Copyright of Terry Huson &  Phyl Pape.

Link below to East Dulwich Pubs 1944


Hardware Shop corner of Pellatt Road & Landcroft Road – 1930s – 1940s

DCS Archives

Hardware shop in Pellatt / Landcroft road, possibly 1930s/40s, The fella with the cap and white apron on was Tommy North, Carol Seymour’s Dad’s Brother, At the time of this photo he was 13 years old but sadly died 6 to 7 years later from rheumatic fever. The only other thing I can say about the shop is that it had a 500 gallon tank of paraffin behind the front door for customers to fill there gallon cans for heating at home, no health and safety then.          

                                                  Information supplied by Dave & Carol Seymour

Pellatt Road 2

The same building today (2014)

Untitled-1 copy

Information very kindly supplied by Dave & Carol (North) Seymour

The Milkman in the above photo is about 18 years old. He was born in 1889 and was Carol Seymour’s Grandad. His name was Leonard Henry North. The photo was probably taken outside 187 Landells Road in the early 1900s, where he lived with his parents. The house was in the North family from 1891 – 1987. The Dairy he worked for was Evans Dairy situated on the junction of Glengary Road and East Dulwich Grove, opposite Dulwich Hospital.

Photos Courtesy & Copyright of Dave & Carol Seymour               DCS Archives


(below is an extract from the 1964 Kellys Directory)

List of shops in Underhill Road 1964 (Kellys Directory)


underhill road shops 1964 adj

Below is a List of the shops in Upland Road in 1967 (Kellys London Directory 1967)



The Origins of Place Bakeries in Dulwich by Mary Smith

My Nan was born in Shap in Cumbria around the turn of the century with the name of Bland.  The family all called her Sissy so I suppose her name was Cecilia or something close to that.  She married into the Place family when she married my Grandad and although he was a Yorkshireman from Barnoldswick, near Colne, they all moved to Blackpool where they had a guest house.  I remember my Dad telling me that as he grew up that if they could take in another guest then he would have to give up his bedroom for them as it meant extra income for the family.

Nan was the entrepreneur but times were hard.  Dad’s sister Annie was close in age to him and they were all brought up with a strong work ethic.  Grandad’s sister had married a Frenchman, Charles, a baker who also lived in Blackpool and they had a son Jeff so Jeff, Dad and Annie grew up as friends.  They somehow got hold of a film projector and would show films to all the local children in a shed and charge them an entrance fee.  Ten years after my Dad, John (but known as Jock) and Annie were born along came my uncle, Lionel who is still fit and well today.  As children Dad and Annie looked after him while Nan was working hard and obviously led him into all sorts of mischief.

Well before the second WW started Uncle Charles had moved to East Dulwich in London to start up a bakery business.  He encouraged the rest of the family to move down too.  They rented a shop in Lordship Lane which had a bakery oven in the cellar.  They bought bread from Charles and later rented another shop further up the parade where they also lived opposite ‘The Plough’ pub.   In the 2nd WW this shop was bombed so they all moved out to live in a large house opposite where several other families had been housed.  After the end of the war they bought the bombed site where the shop was and had it rebuilt with a large bakehouse at the rear.  There was also a space for afternoon teas to be served.  My Nan and Grandad lived in a large maisonette above this shop which became the head office of Place Bakeries.

My Nan ran a small grocery shop in the original rented shop and eventually bought the freehold.  She was well thought of by all her customers.  She had a heart of gold and would always see that those families who were hard up got little extras in their order, which they didn’t have to pay for.  She was also a very unwell lady who had had a lung removed – a huge operation in those days and had to survive with dreadful scarring which never healed properly.  She needed oxygen support on bad days all the time I was aware of her.  She didn’t make old bones, always looked very old to me and died when she was in her early 60s.  I loved her lots obviously.  My twin brother and I were the apples of her eye and she always told us that she would take the top brick off the chimney if we wanted it.  I didn’t see the attraction of a brick luckily.

Everything was going well so she negotiated a loan from the bank – apparently she was good at twisting the bank manager’s arm – to buy the bakery at the bottom end of Lordship Lane with a shop at the front from Uncle Charles.  They hired bakers to work for them and the bread was lovely – ‘the crust with the crackle’ was the logo and it was too!  Cakes, buns etc were made at the bakehouse opposite ‘The Plough’ pub.

Dad had qualified as an engineer and Lionel and him had started a factory making pushchairs before and after the war.  Dad’s eyesight was not good enough for the war effort and Lionel was too young so they both managed to miss active service.  Later Lionel became the manager of all the shops they had acquired, delivering all the goods to them and sorting out the problems and Dad would deliver bread with Lionel at 5am and then go to his day job as an engineer for the government.  He calculated all the wages, tax etc in the evenings.  I always remember him working.  It’s ironic that neither him nor Lionel could bake bread; in fact my Dad struggled to boil an egg!

The business was sold to the employees around the 70s as a going concern but whether they weren’t prepared to work as hard as Lionel and Dad or whether the opening of supermarkets which sold everything was their downfall, I don’t know.  I suspect the supermarkets with their cheap, tasteless, doughy bread were to blame but people got cheaper food and maybe couldn’t afford the crust with the crackle any more.  Place Bakeries is no more but remembered by many.  I still hate supermarket bread and always look for rustic bakers to buy from.  I hope the tide is turning as people realise the difference in taste.

Recently I decided to turn a lot of old slide photos into digital form.  Mostly I did people but found these 2 that were taken in Dulwich Park – the handcart and the other was at the exit of the park into the village.  It was a procession to commemorate something in the 60s but I have no idea what it was.  My Dad and Lionel his brother decided it would be good to paint up the old cart with the Place Bakeries logo and one of the lads from the bakery called Brian would haul it through the procession.  It looked quite grand.  
Dad and Lionel had an adopted auntie who married a signwriter called Jack Wiltshire.  I found it fascinating watching him work on the vans with a hand steadier – a stick with a padded end and his soft, long bristled paint brushes as they curled around the shapes of all the letters.  It really was a skilled job.  I also remember his old van which was covered in paints of different colours where he had tried them out, spillages in the inside and the way it bounced up and down the unmade road (Mount Adon Park) at the back of us because the shock absorbers had long gone!
These photos were taken at the Dulwich Millennium Celebrations, June 1967.

Origin of Place Bakery information & photos courtesy & copyright of Mary Smith

Thank you Mary

Copyright – ©  Important Notice – Please note all material on this website, photos, information & design is protected by owner copyright. It is an offence to use any of the material from this website without the owners permission.©

Link to the youtube video of Dulwich celebrations 1967

(Copyright The Dulwich Society)


106 Responses to Shops & Pubs of East Dulwich Remembered

  1. Peter R Brown says:

    I attended Heber Rd Primary School from 1954 to 60 my Brother Alan Brown was also there 5 years later. We lived at 13 Silvester Rd East Dulwich. I am currently living in Adelaide South Australia.

    • Snowli says:

      I was born in 1946 at 173 Underhill road lived there until I left school in 1963 I went to Friern road school and then to Goodrich school. Used to play up Dawsons Hill which I believe is an estate now, they were good days, I wonder if anyone remembers the above, your site is very interesting bringing back so many memories, thank you .

      • Ray mcnally says:

        I lived in Dunstans Road which had sloping gardens leading to Dawson Hill.
        Fond memories of Guy Fawkes night when all the local families joined in a joint firework display baking potatoes in biscuit tins on the fire and firing rockets to repel invaders from the top of the hill .it wasn’t gang warfare but light hated fun.
        Dawson hill was a playground for us youngsters gathering scrap metal for the local steptoe and son merchant..remember well getting sixpence for each sheet of large metal we brought to him

      • Marshall Clark says:

        Was Friern Road School opposite Rye Park where it was possible to see a long line of elm trees leading into the park and where we used to pick up bits of shrapnel during lunch times and the headmaster was a Welshman called Mr. Jones? This could be where I spent a couple of years during the war. I might be able to remember a few more names if I think about it a bit more.
        I ended up in East Dulwich secondary School under the tyrant of a Headmistress called Miss Ambler. I think this was in Goodrich road. I am unable to find any mention of this school, anywhere.
        It seemed to have quite modern ideas, fantastic choir, great drama and music department. This is apart from the old dragon who was running it. I can still remember her, all light blue with extreme wrinkles, with white hair tucking a dainty handkerchief into her cuff with a superior manner. The only other teacher I can remember was Mr. Micheal (drama and English) who was going to get me into Cambridge if I cleaned up my Maths. I am currently living in New South Wales, Australia.

        • Frederick Ricketts says:

          Yes. Friern Rd. school is where you remember. Another school named Dulwich Central shared the same building with it’s own staff. One couldn’t apply to attend the Central school but had to be offered a place. I think mainly it was for pupils who had just missed passing what was then called the Scholarship which I think was taken at about the age of 10. I was one of those and as far as I can remember it would have been around 1940 when I went there. Some time later around 1941 we left Friern Rd and moved up to Goodrich Rd, which was empty due to the war, we occupied the annex. Our head mistress was as you said Miss Ambler but I can’t agree with your view of her. Far from being a tyrant we all looked upon her with affection so much so that some years after I left I was contacted by a former pupil asking if I would like to contribute to a retirement present for her, which I was happy to do. Mr Michael was there in my time, other teachers were Miss Faulkner who taught PT and Music, as you said we could sing which was down to her and she instilled in me a love of singing and classical music which has lasted all my life and I’m 90 years of age now. Another teacher was Mr. Thomas who did science. Some time after I left in 1945 the school was upgraded to a secondary and changed it’s name.

    • Susan Brady says:

      My mum lived in 13 Sylvester Road, She was born in 1909, not sure if she lived there from birth but was certainly there when my grand father went to war in 1914

    • Vicki patsalou says:

      Just saw this, my husband lived at 15 Silvester Road, he says he remembers you, his name is jack.

      • robert walsh says:

        I remember Jackie Patsalou, he used to date my sister Anna Walsh way back when I was a 12, I believe he used to ride a Suzuki motorbike, we lived in Woodvale then! oh the memories.

      • Andy brown says:

        I remember Jackie and Micky I live at no
        11, I was mates with Micky and my brother les was mates with jackie

    • Malcolm Beck says:

      Hi Peter
      I used to be good friends with an Alan Brown was your mum from Austria??
      if so this is the right Alan Brown.
      Cheers Malcolm Beck

    • Andy brown says:

      I lived at 11 silvester road my cousins Peter and Alan brown myself went to Hebert road in the sixties.

    • Malcolm Beck says:

      Hi Peter I used to be friends with your brother Alan I hope you are both keeping well Please remember me to him Cheers Malcolm

    • June Rattenbury says:

      Hey there Peter

      I lived at 16 Silvester Road. I remember the Browns name, maybe Dot Brown, Les, Andrew not sure. My maiden name was Ward, Jean and Charlie (mum and dad), sister Lesley

  2. Pauline says:

    I am trying to trace my grandparents shop in London “Hewitt leather and Grindery” does anyone remember it, where it was?

  3. John reed says:

    Does anybody have pictures of the houses that were demolished in Dunstans road. To allow the building of Dawson’s heights. Hope somebody can help

  4. Jock's Daughter Marianne says:

    I am trying to find out the history of No. 1 Landcroft Road (corner of Whateley Road) East Dulwich, which was my parents Fish & Chip shop called The Devonshire Fish Bar. Now a sad and abandoned ex Chinese takeaway. Does anyone know any history of our old house as I believe it was once an old farm house? Can anyone help, please?

    • Caroline Evans says:

      Hello Marianne
      I was reading this interesting book and saw your comment.
      I cant answer your question but I remember your Fish and Chip shop well. We always called it Smiths. I lived on Whateley Road and used to play with you.
      I often reminisce with friends and family about the lovely chips and wondered how you are?
      I’m Caroline and my brother is Robert Evans – Irish Family despite the name.

      • Marianne says:

        It’s been a while since I’ve been on this site and I DO remember you Caroline and your brother. How lovely to hear from you. Here’s my email address x

      • Marianne says:

        It was really nice to hear from you Caroline. Sorry for the lengthy reply…… I hope you are all keeping well. x

      • Marion McEnaney says:

        Hi Caroline,
        Just saw your comments. I remember you and your brother, also your mum and dad- by the way I loved the chips in that chip shop!
        I lived in Jennings Road. I have a great picture of your mum and dad with my mum and dad .
        Marion McEnaney

  5. colleen Wilson says:

    We lived over Wheelers the bakers in Lordship Lane on the corner of Frogley Rd. during WW2. When the air raids were on we used to go in where the ovens were because their were no windows. The baker would give us hot rolls.I remember the windows being blown out and we moved into a house opposite. Nix’s the greengrocers was on the corner and Gracie Nix was a friend of my mum and aunt. My great aunt and uncle were stewards of the Dulwich Club in Lordship Lane and we went to the VE party there.

  6. Richard Beadle says:

    Hello Marianne, If you look at my post in the “Boy from East Dulwich” thread you’ll see that I mention your parent’s fish and chip shop. I remember that your mother was a blond German lady and she served the customers while your dad fried the fish and chips. They also served faggots and pease pudding on the side.

  7. Marianne says:

    Oh thanks Richard.

  8. My name was Patricia Ross I lived in 33 Hillcourt Rd East Dulwich from May 1946 until 1956. I now live in Brisbane Australia. I knew a family called Sibley. Mr. Sibley used to work in a bakery in Lordship Lane in the 1940’s & 1950’s.

  9. I attended Thomas Calton school infants in 1946 until approximately 1948. Then from about 1953 until 1956. I also attended Heber Road in 1948 at the age of about 7 – 10

    • John Chinery says:

      Hi Pat, Thank you for your memories, if you have any photos you would be willing to share of your schooldays, the house or road you lived in plus any other memories you have it would be great to have them on my website, I am just trying to build up a history of the areas I mention before all these wonderful memories are lost.

      I was born in East Dulwich, as were my Parents and the rest of my family, I grew up there, went to School there at Heber Road and then Thomas Calton, then I worked for Southwark Council when I left school, so it is a place that means a lot to me, any help you can give Pat would be fantastic.

      Best wishes

  10. Deborah Watts says:

    My Grandparents owned a greengrocer shop at 2 Adys Road, Peckham, S.E. London in 1930’s. was wondering if there was any pictures or articles with regards to this

  11. Marianne says:

    Hi to everyone in East Dulwich. Does anyone know if they’ve started work on our old fish and chip shop yet, The Devonshire Fish Bar, (ex Golden Fillet!) No. 1 Landcroft Road? Thanks.
    Jock’s Daughter.

    • Marianne says:

      I’ve seen the photos now. At least “the old lady” The Devonshire Fish Bar has some dignity again.

      • John Bown says:

        Hi Marianne I remember the fish and chip shop corner of Whateley and Landcroft. I lived in Whateley Road from 1939 until 1960. One of our favourite things was to get a Vienna loaf from Kerry’s the bakers in Silvester road tear the end off eat the dough on the way to the fish and chip shop buy some chips or cracklings stuff the crust and enjoy a culinary delight! I seem to remember the fryer being a foreign gentleman and his wife doing the serving. They had a white Bull Terrier that came in the shop put it’s paws on the shelf behind the counter and dared you to make a false move. Totally unacceptable these days but back in the early 1950’s nobody worried. Happy days!

        • Marianne says:

          Lovely to hear from you! Our bull terrier was very protective over me. Mum could leave me in my pram outside a shop (thank goodness that doesn’t happen these days!) and you’re right, no one dare make a false move or come near me! Unfortunately, one day our dog wasn’t with us and I had a huge brown teddy bear mum sat on top of my pram and sadly it got stolen. I agree about the unacceptability.

    • Christina Murray says:

      Hi Marianne, I remember you and your mum and dad’s chip shop! My dad and mum, Jack and Joy Joslin, owned the newsagents just up the road. I seem to recall we played together as young children. I also recall there being a fire in your house once, when the TV burst into flames and ignited the curtains! Hope life has been less dramatic for you since that incident and has treated you well. Kind regards, Christina Murray (nee Joslin).

      • Marianne says:

        Hi Christina

        It’s been a while since I’ve been on this fascinating site, but I do remember you and also your mum and dad. I believe the tv fire was up the road from us. I think they owned a butchers shop. My dad called the fire brigade. I remember being ever so worried about their dog, but he thankfully managed to escape. We did have a fire in our shop – inside the chimney, which set light to part of our upstairs lounge, but my parents were quick and dad especially. They put out the fire just before the fire brigade got to us. I think they got treated to some fish and chips though! It’s lovely to hear from you.

  12. Janet shine says:

    We used to live opposite Dawson’s hill, THE DUMP as we called it. I remember playing over there, It was a great childhood, we could all run free, amongst all the broken glass and debris of the war, without any healt and safety issues! we all survived it!!

    I also went to heber and Goodrich in the fifties. I had a teacher called miss greening, with bright red hair.
    The only thing I think I learnt there was a dance we had to do for our parents, we had bright tissue flowers pinned on us. I can still remember the dance. I had a horrid time at that school.
    My name is Janet. Our family name was Tandy.
    My auntie Nora had a hairdressers shop off Crystal Palace road.
    I seem to remember a shop called Latters at the top of Dunstans.
    Also a shop near heber where the shopkeeper used to bring out a tray of Tizer for the kids.
    I don’t do Facebook, so loved this site when I found it, although I see some of the postings are quite old now!
    Love reading your memories.

  13. Are there any photographs of streamline motorcycles 533 lordship lane 1970s

  14. Ron lambert says:

    Has anybody out there got any pictures of Streamline Motorcycles or know me, my name is Ronnie Lambert, I used to live at 337 Lordship Lane and went to Heber Road school from 1959 to 1966.

  15. Mrs. Phyllis Pape nee Cooper says:

    I was born in to the Crystal Palace Tavern in 1927 and it was then owned by Mr. G. Burtwell. My parents George and Caroline Cooper were Managers. We moved in 1930 to a pub in London and my parents became Licensees in their own right. We moved again in 1932 to the Grove Hotel S Wimbledon and stayed there until 1944 when we returned to the CPT. I remember Hastings the greengrocer and Astells the butcher. My Mother’s maiden name was Freathy and several family members lived in the area. George and Liz’s house received a direct hit from a V1 I cannot remember the name of the road. Annie Barber, Rose Blair and Lil were my Mother’s sisters. Sadly my Mother passed away in 1942. The first of a family of 11 to die. My Father and I eventually moved away in 1944. I have photos of the pub in earlier days. We had the off sales bar at the side and used to sell something called Red Biddy. I recently looked this up on the internet and was amazed that anyone would drink it. I cannot imagine any of our old customers are still around but maybe relatives will recall them talking about the pub and the Freathy family.

    Terry Huson says:

    Although My Mother was living at the Crystal Palace Tavern during the war while my father was away, I was actually born in Streatham where, for some reason, my grandfather thought it safer than Dulwich. After my mother was discharged from the nursing home I’m told we were put up in a flat somewhere near the CPT until we moved to Merton Park about the time my Aunt left the CPT. If my aunt left in 1948/9 then I would only have been around 6 or 7 so have no knowledge of shops etc in the area, except for a pet shop opposite the CPT in Crystal Palace road. I have returned once to the pub and found it almost unchanged from my distant memory of it, albeit with some internal modifications like the removal of the narrow corridor that led to the counter where locals could purchase a jug of beer that several people posting on your site seem to remember.

    • John Chinery says:

      Hi Phyllis,
      Thank you for getting in touch, its always great to have new memories & photos when possible,they are so important, I created this website for anyone that would be interested and appreciate any help with any new information, all my family used the The Crystal Palace Tavern for years,it has changed so much over the years, I used to go into the off license to buy lemonade & smiths crisps when I was growing up, it would be great to have your photos on the site Phyllis if you are willing to share them, many thanks again for getting in touch and thank you for adding your memories.

      Also, many thanks for your memories Terry, much appreciated

      Best wishes, John

    • Ron Elston says:

      Direct hit by V1 was Underhill Road which destroyed my grandparents and dads home along the terrace which later became a council run home after the prefabs were demolished. Opposite on the corner of Henslowe Road was a grocers corner shop in line with the shop on the corner of Friern Road, which for many years you could still see the remains of the steps and base of telephone booth along side the prefab home of the lovely very talented musical family of Kenny Chapel. I did meet Peter Sarsdted? “Where do you go to my lovely” was a track he recorded leaving a prefab not sure which address? but where new homes have been built after the council home demolition. Fond memories of all who lived within the area. Best

      • Malcolm Beck says:

        Hi Ron (Its Malcolm Beck) the last time i saw you I think was at Mickey Doyles Funeral that must be about 50 years ago! My Grandad had the Tobacconists Shop (Chappells) in Upland Road at the bottom of Henslowe Road. Are you still living in Dulwich?
        I hope you are keeping well. Cheers Malc

        • Ronnie Elston says:


          Remember you moving to Sittingbourne many years ago.
          I am living in Sidcup and Yorkshire as I am now semi retired from many years of managing in local council. I remember the workbench camp with the drop down entrance in your Grandads garage to the back of the shop. Your first I think record “Bridge over Troubled Water” and the soft spot you had for the girl who used to help the milkman(United Dairies ) on Saturdays with deliveries those were the day’s. My work colleague is married to the
          son of Carol Barber(Henslowe Road). The people I remember from Friern infants to Heber and finally Thomas Colton and the area in general where would I start ?
          John you may be interested? the garages in Henslowe Road are soon to be demolished. The old wall which was part of the old transport depot having originally huge metal gates will also go. I have managed to photograph the walls and granite sets to the entrance as I feel all will be lost, like the old water tank next Banfield’s timber yard now just a memory.

          • Malcolm Beck says:

            Hi Ron, blimey you remember the camp under the work bench! Carol Barber yes I remember her and her brother Trevor. What ever happened to the girlfriend you had called Cathy I think? I moved to Cranleigh in Surrey my Cousins Stephen & Keith Haynes moved to Sittingbourne. Hows your brother Viv? Glad your ok mate.

    • Linda Allen says:

      Hi my daughter and family have bought 199 Crystal Palace Road, it used to be a shop, possible an opticians. They are restoring the front to how it used to look, where as most of the other shop fronts have been changed to look just as houses.
      If you are looking at the pub they are a few houses along on the right the other side of Underhill Road. Does any one remember what shops were along there, the shop front is a dark green, or have any pictures ?

      • John Chinery says:

        Hi Linda,
        In 1960 199 was a watch repair shop, it was called Inghams (Walter Herbert) I remember it had a load of mantel clocks and watches in the windows, I can’t remember if green was the original colour, I have a feeling it was black. 197 was Pococks a wet fish shop, 195 on the corner was Musico Ciro a box maker, the other side of 199 at 203 & 205 was the Royal Arsenal Co-op Society Ltd, quite a large double fronted shop, at 207 was Suttons (Lewis) a Drapers shop and 209 was Ronalds (Joslin Jack) a Newsagents, cigarettes and sweet shop…….on the opposite side of the road on the corner at no 200 was Spinneys (George Thomas) an Antique shop & Furniture Removals, I remember Mrs Spinney used to sit in a rocking chair in the shop. Hope all this info helps Linda.

        Best wishes
        John Chinery

      • Christina Murray says:

        Hi Linda, my dad, Jack Joslin, owned the newsagents/tobacconist at 209 Crystal Palace Road. I will try and find a picture of the exterior for you.
        Kind regards
        Christina Murray (nee Joslin)

        • John Chinery says:

          Hi Christine, It would be lovely to have a photo of your a Dads Newsagents in Crystal Palace Road on this website along with any memories you may have if possible and with your permission, I used to go into your Dads shop a lot and on my way to school, I remember it used to have a cigarette machine out the front. I created this site for anyone that might be interested and to build up a history of the area before all those memories are lost, if you can help in any way Christine that would be great. Kind Regards, John Chinery

        • Debbie Payne says:

          OMG just stumbled across this site. I lived opposite Jacks the newsagents at 218Crystsl Palace Rd until the age of 7 ? when we moved round the corner to Pellatt Rd. 1963-1970.
          I remember coming across to play with you occasionally and attending a birthday party too. My names Debbie Payne (nee Brady) my dad Den used to take me across each evening to spend my sixpence in your dads shop. I seem to remember he had a little lending library towards the back of the shop too.
          I remember Mrs Sutton’s next door, some of my dresses used to come from there. We lived opposite next door to the greengrocers.

      • Christina Murray says:

        Hi Linda, my mum and dad, Jack and Joy Joslin, used to own the newsagents/tobacconist at 209 Crystal Palace Road. I will try to find a picture of the frontage for you.
        Kind regards
        Christina Murray (nee Joslin)

      • LINDA ROWDEN-ALLEN says:

        Hi Linda, my name too is Linda Allen and at the time I was born we lived at 127 Upland RD my dad was Sidney James Allen I just wondered if you or the family are related in any way as have been looking for my half brother David for a while now he and his family lived the other side of Peckham Rye Park. If you can shed any light my email is Many thanks Linda

  16. Mrs Phyllis Pape nee Cooper says:

    I have to change two dates we left the Grove Hotel in 1940 and finally moved away in 1948/49 Put the mistakes down to old age!!! I will try to send one or two photos in due course. My knowledge of technology in this area is not too good.

  17. peter leberl says:

    My grandma and grandad Joe and Ruby Leberl ran one of the pubs at Crystal Palace before it was bombed. They then moved to the Paxton Arms but bombed out again in 1944. Does anyone remember them and which pub they ran – was it the Crystal Palace Hotel – can’t find any details of the CP or was it Royal CP hotel then?

  18. Mrs Phyllis Pape nee ~Cooper says:

    I have remembered some customer’s names. The Watt family. Mother, Father and son Sydney. I think Father and son were bakers at a shop just round the corner from the CPT. Also Mr and Mrs. Morley. I visited their son Chuck in E. Dulwich Hospital. Sadly he died at the age of 21 from an illness he had contracted whilst serving with the army in Germany. Finally, Mr and Mrs. Hart their son Len was a keen cyclist and raced at the Herne Hill track. I cannot recall any others and doubt if there is anyone around now who would remember them either – but perhaps there is just a chance.

    • John Chinery says:

      Hi Phyliss,
      Many thanks for sharing more memories of your time in East Dulwich, it is very much appreciated. It is so important to record and save peoples memories and photos before they are lost forever.

      Thank you once again
      Kind Regards

  19. Vikki says:


    This is an incredible thread. I’m researching the history of my home in Upland rd (before Barry Rd junction) and wondered if anyone had any memories or photos of the hairdressers which used to be there between Barry Rd and Hindmans.
    There was a greengrocer on one side and a butchers on the other.
    1935 -1953 was a George and Eliza Jewell and from then up to ’86 was Derick / Douglas Smith
    Be amazing to hear anything you remember, thanks so much.

    • Malcolm Beck says:

      Hi Vikki
      There used to be a Barbers Called Doug’s, A Toy shop and Stevens Bakers on the corner of Barry Road if you cross the road going up Upland Road there was a Church then a row of shops the first was My Grandparent’s Sweet shop (55 Upland Road) called Chappells then a Grocers, then a Hardware shop called Paveys and then a Hairdressers i think!! We lived at 73 Upland Road and our garden backed on to Frien Road Girls School.
      hope this helps you

      • Wendy Dunlop says:

        My Dad was a policeman and we lived at Dukas Court (now Rye Court) which were police owned flats in 1950’s +60’s. I went to Friern Infants School, Dulwich Hamlet, then Honor Oak Girls Grammar. I live in New Zealand now but I remember going to Mrs Cooper’s sweet shop, Mr Pavey’s hardware shop, sunday school at the Upland Rd Methodist and to Jones & Higgins. There was a fair on Peckham Rye, we learned to swim at the freezing cold Lido pool opposite the Kings Arms and my brothers went to Saturday morning pictures at Goose Green!

        • Malcolm Beck says:

          Hi Wendy
          I used to play football with my mates at Dukas Court, Peter Jeffries, Gerald Long and the Kinnears.
          My nans sweet shop was at the entrance to Dukas Court from the Upland Road side. I also used to go to the open air pool!

        • Richard Beasley says:

          Hello Wendy, We also lived in Dukas Court up until around 1964 or so. My father, Graham Beasley, was also a policeman. I was very young but still recall a scary basement area beneath the flats where my sister, Stephanie and I would play. Both her and myself had two unfortunate incidents. She fell off a wall at the back of the flats and broke her leg and I got entangled with a bike near the entrance to the block and ripped open my top lip. I believe that I was only about three at the time but I still remember an older boy riding a white bicycle. I still bear a scar on my top lip to this day. I now live in Folkestone , Kent and would like to visit the block one day.

          • Wendy Dunlop says:

            Goodness I remember walking to your Nan’s sweet shop on Upland Rd almost next to Mr Pavey’s. There was a bomb site on the corner of Friern and Peckham Rye and we were forbidden to step on it on our way toFriern Infants School. I remember being taught there by Mrs Roberts, Miss Barnes and Mrs Robinson and the Headmistress Miss Bromley. I am still in touch with Graham Sheath who lived in the next door flat to ours at Dukas Court. His Dad left the police and they emigrated to Australia. I also remember summer kids concerts on Peckham Rye.

    • Janet says:

      My auntie Nora used to have a hairdressers around there (Tandy) does this ring any bells?

    • Janet says:

      Hi Vikki
      My auntie “Nora Tandy”used to have hairdressing shop near Barry rd, does it ring any bells?

    • John Chinery says:

      Hi Vikki,
      I have uploaded a list of the shops you are interested in from Kellys Directory 1967, hope this helps.

      Kind Regards
      John Chinery

      • Malcolm Beck says:

        Hi John
        Yes I remember all those shops and my Mum and Nan used to have their hair done at Tandy’s My Grandparents had the Confectionery / Tobacconists at No 55 called Chappells.
        I remember going to Marriott’s Toy shop and collecting the Matchbox Series!! Cheers Malc

        • Patricia Cook nee Young says:

          Hi Malcolm, I have been meaning to comment on your reference to Tandy’s Ladies Hairdressers. Well I lived there at 65 Upland from 1946 to 1963. Nora was my Auntie who ran the shop. She used to try out all the new treatments on my hair. I remember having a perm! something called a Madison Wave which meant .I had heated rollers attached to my head to ‘burn’ the curls in. It worked but I did not want to go to school as everyone called me Shirley Temple. Do not have any photographs of the shop. Remember most of the shops in the Parade, Pavey’s where we used to get some of our groceries and items such as putty ,sash cord, for skipping ropes and turps etc. was next door, then Wise and Chapman, painters and Decorators, where we used to buy our paint and borrow the wallpaper pattern books, ordering paper and getting it within a day or two .There was an Express Dairy next . Cannot remember the other shops until the Grocers which was run by a Mr and Mrs Amos it was a smashing shop loved the bacon from there. They were always in spotless white overalls everything seemed so clean. Then of course Chappells, and all the goodies, ice cream, sweets and Tizer!!!!! Mr Chappell kept some other items too remember the Ipecec and Lemon Linctus,Snowfire Face Cream and Melrose hand repair against chapped hands. It was a tobacconists as well. Visited the shop frequently! Probably knew your mum but time does fade memories. There was an alley way down the back where my dad built a garage which was handy on Bonfire Night as we all used to sit in the Garage with Hot dogs and Jacket Potatoes whilst the Bonfire was lit in the alley, always seemed to have lots of visitors then. Hope to remember some other bits soon. Regards

  20. Mrs Carol Starr says:

    Lovely to read about Places bakers. I remember it well. Used to go there all the time and loved the cakes and bread. My name was Carol Kite now Carol Starr. I lived in Belvoir Road, went to Grove Vale school and then to Thomas Calton, firstly in Goodrich Road and then the school was moved to Peckham. I lived in Dulwich from 1945 until I got married in 1965. I got married in St. Peter’s church near the pub called The Grove Tavern. I also remember Dunstan’s Hill, played there all the time. I spent most of my childhood playing in Dulwich Park, it was really lovely then and used to go on the lake in the rowing boats with my sister Patricia and my friend Vivian Saggers. My mother also worked in Jones and Higgins, again a lovely shop which I am sure doesn’t exist any more.

  21. Paul Newman says:

    Fascinating to read all the memories of my local area when I was a boy. I lived in Friern Rd and went to the Friern Rd Infants School, then on the Heber Rd Primary and then to William Penn Secondary.
    The names of the shops in Upland road bring back evocative memories – as does Dunstans Hill, another play area. The bomb site at the end of Friern Rd, just across the road from Peckham Rye Park was another early play area where we rode our bikes with cowhorn handlebars. Jones and Higgins shop at the far end of Rye Lane was always unupmarket venue for special things.

  22. Well, what a find !
    Wonderful to read about times past in a search for pictures and articles for my 88 year old mum who used to live in Pellatt Rd in East Dulwich . She is now in a Dementia Care home bless her, and I’m aiming to put a scrap book of memories together for her by Christmas 2020 if I can .
    I used to go to Goodrich Infants school ( Headmistress was Mrs. Bastable) then Heber Road school before moving to Bromley, Kent in 1969 .
    I had 2 friends who were sisters called Kim and Tracey – lived in Friern Road …
    First names I can remember from Heber Road School?
    Let’s see – Gloria, Diane , Lesley, Helen ( Shaw), Toni R , Samson, Alan (Woods?) , Neil, Jennifer, Dale . I wonder whether any of these people will see this post and respond ?
    My grandparents ( had a fruit and veg stall in North Cross Road , probably in the early 1940’s at least , owned a cart-horse called ‘Dolly’ ; used to give me and my cousins 6d each every weekend to spend at ‘Rob’s‘ (?) sweet shop on the corner of Pellatt Road.
    Lordship Lane was still the shopping hub , I remember a Clarke’s Shoe shop along there.
    Sunday’s in the winter would involve a regular trip to the hot Sasperilla stall for a comforting drink and a bag full of hot Chesnuts to eat – those were the days !
    I look forward to anyone who can relate to the above with enthusiasm ….??.

    • John Bown says:

      Hi Pat just seen your post and it is a shame about your Mum. I don’t know if this helps but a rough calculation puts you at Heber Rd school in the early 1950’s This would place you there at the same time as my sister Shirley and her best friend Diane Dowie. I do remember the stalls in Northcross Rd and I do believe they were still there in 1960. There are a few interesting posts on this site under shops and pubs of East Dulwich hope you find what you are looking for

      • Ruth Dean says:

        Hi janet ,Was your grandparents hastings by any chance ?

        Hi john bown
        My mum jill /gillian hastings also remembers diane dowie .
        Her and her brother attended st John’s & st Clements infants together, my mum thinks his name was Keith dowie .

        • John Bown says:

          Hi Ruth it’s right that Dianne Dowie had a brother called Keith who I believe was friends with Richard Beadle who has also posted items on this site

    • Ruth Dean says:

      Hi janet ,Was your grandparents hastings by any chance ?

    • andy gould says:

      Also lived on Pellatt Rd remember Robs shop and many of the same stores on Lordship Lane, went to Heber rd and then Thomas Carlton on Adys rd moved to USA in 79 but still have great memories

  23. Does anyone remember Alberts ? Where everyone who was a teenager in early 1950s met up, it was opposite Doug’s Hairdressers, my now husband lived in Barry rd.

    • John Chinery says:

      Hi Pat, I was born in East Dulwich in 1952, lived in Underhill Road and moved out in 1978, I don’t ever remember Dougs Hairdressers or Alberts, the only Hairdressers I knew was in Underhill road parade of shops, his name was Edgar Hannant and Seagars hairdresser in Upland road, I have looked through the 1952, 1956 & 1960 Kellys Directories for you at Underhill Road, Upland Road, Lordship Lane and Barry Road and there is no mention of Dougs Hairdressers or Alberts, there was a Cafe called Barry Parade Cafe. Have you any idea where Dougs or Alberts was situated ?

      Kind regards
      John Chinery

      • Malcolm Beck says:

        Hi John, Dougs the barbers was next to Nethercotts Greengrocers along from Marriotts Toy shop, Blanchflowers Shoe Shop and Stevens the Bakers was on the corner of Upland Road and Barry Road. Segas the Barbers was down Barry Road in the parade of shops opposite the rye.

      • Frank Grace says:

        I have just seen the site, fascinating! I was born in 1943 was at Thomas Calton School 1954/1959. I remember the barbers at the bottom of Barry Road and I think Doug rings a bell. At the far end of Barry Road was Segas hairdressers (hope I have the correct spelling ) Doug often mentioned it and thinking back he was probably taken over by Segas Or was just employed by him, I remember going to Doug with a large photo of Elvis and wanted my hair styled like him( in those days I had thick black hair) Doug took one look at the photo and said “bloody ‘ell!) Later on I went to Mr Segas who said he would die for hair like mine! I used Jeans record shop just off Rye Lane and PeckhamRye Park was my playground. I loved my childhood, so many happy memories,I was known as Harry then. There is not enough room here to list my memories so I had better stop before you nod off!

        • John Chinery says:

          Hi Frank, Thank you so much for getting in touch and leaving your memories, if you have any photos you would be willing to share on here along with any other memories you might have that would be great, always grateful for any new memories/photos of East Dulwich, Peckham or surrounding areas, memories/photos are so important, just trying build up a history before it is all lost, many thanks again Frank.
          Kind Regards
          John Chinery

    • John Bown says:

      Hi Pat I was a teenager in the 1950’s and believe that Alberts was a favourite with us youngsters and was situated in Crystal Palace Rd in a parade of shops just short of Goodrich Rd

    • Ronnie Elston says:

      Pat, Could Albert be the slim man who always wore a cap and glasses ? had the shop as you say opposites Doug’s, where you could buy a glass of Corona to drink sitting within the shop. May have been called A. Hirt along from James Lane betting shop.


  24. Richard Beadle says:

    I went to an Italian hairdressers next to the Magdala pub in Lordship Lane. They had special prices for kids on a Friday afternoon and I remember rushing home afterwards to be in time to see the Cisco Kid which was showing on children’s hour on our 12 inch black & white TV.

    • Ruth Dean says:

      Richard beadle.
      You went to school with my mum jill / gillian hastings . St John’s & st Clements.
      She remembers you hurting yourself while on a school holiday to Belgium.
      She said you was always very nice to her .

  25. Richard Beadle says:

    Hi Ruth, yes I jumped off the pier on the St John’s school journey to Blankenberge in 1958 ( I must have been mad to try that!), trying to impress your mum. I always think of her as my first girlfriend although we were only 11 years old at the time. I landed on the sand and my tooth went right though the flesh on my chin into my knee and yes I do still have the scar.

  26. Liz French says:

    I was wondering if anyone remembers who lived in the flat above the Place Bakeries, Lordship Lane around the 1960s. I am trying to remember the name of the young lady.
    There was a young couple and the young lady used to do cake making classes which my Mother Gladys Matthews and I, Elizabeth French nee Matthews used to go to.
    We lived in Crystal Palace Road.
    I would be very grateful for any help with memories of this time.
    Thank you

  27. Dave Hill says:

    We used to live at 283 Crystal Palace Road in East Dulwich, Dad had the fish and chip shop across the road from The Castle Pub. I Went to Heber Rd school 1946 or 1947, my Sister Barbara will know the dates as she went there too many many moons ago but I can remember like it was yesterday

  28. Barrie Kidd says:

    Hi I lived at 52a, Silvester Road opposite the then Sorting Office from when I was born in 1942 until 1962. I attended Heber Road School and then Thomas Calton. I remember
    Taskers haberdashery shop on the corner of Crystal Palace Rd/Silvester there was a newsagents next door also on the other corner was an Ice cream shop that use to supply the stop me and buy one tricycles. Some names I remember from the area were Norman Hurst, John Jenner, Don Crawford, Robert Utting, Christine Jones, Austin Marne. The barbers in Underhill Rd. was run by a man called Jim. and in the same parade was a Dry Cleaners/Laundry. Happy Days. Barrie.

    • Terty Gould says:

      Hello Barrie. I lived at 31 Pellatt Road, attended Heber Road School, Bessemer Grange School and then William Penn School. The newsagent next to Taskers was called Nevills and there was a Post Office on the corner of Pellatt and Crystal Palace Road run by the Warings, I went out with the daughter Barbara. I remember Don Crawford, Christine Jones and John Jenner and also Graham Miles who lived in Silvester Road further down from you. I remember going around all of my friends houses swapping comics. Great times. Terry Gould

      • Barrie Kidd says:

        Hi Terry after all this time a name I remember hope you are keeping well and yes I also remember Graham Miles, I don’t swap comics anymore. I still see Don Crawford as he lives near me here in Whitstable. I have not been back to Dulwich for about 30 years but it is still on my ‘bucket list’ I expect I would not recognize it now. They were great times. Barrie.

        • John Bown says:

          Hi Barrie I lived at 7 Whateley Rd from 1938 until I got married in 1960. I think that your house must have almost backed onto ours with a shared brick wall at the end of our back gardens. The name Kidd is very familiar but I associate it with a female so have you got a sister?

        • John Bown says:

          Hi Barrie time plays tricks with memory but I must say that the surname Kidd is very familiar. My late brother Alan was also born in 1935 so perhaps at some time he was an associate of your brother Tony

  29. Helen McAuliffe says:

    Curious to know if anyone remembers a corner-shop newsagents/sweet shop on Underhill Road, 1940s, owned by Len McAuliffe? He was my Grandad. Thanks for any help…

  30. Hi,
    Does anyone remember the address of the Place Bakery that was near the Plough Pub in Lordship Lane, 1950/1960’s.
    Liz French

  31. John Bown says:

    Hi Elizabeth there is an early post on this link by Mary Smith telling the history of Place Bakery it’s quite lengthy and perhaps you can find your answer there

  32. Viera Rudkins says:

    I was born in Dulwich Hospital.
    Was evacuated from Friern Road School when I was five years old to Dorking in Surrey.
    Returned home to Dulwich and Friern Road School, and then Camberwell Arts School.
    I remember going to school and stopping at Nethercotts the greengrocer in Upland Rd., and buying a big rosy apple for 6d with my dinner money.
    They couldn’t understand why, because my dad had a greengrocers shop in Dulwich, but there was something different in buying my own. I wasn’t allowed to “ eat the profits”.

  33. R says:

    I used to live in Upland Road in the 70s until the early 80s in a flat above ‘Anerly Radio’ electrical, TV (and a at one point a Bike/skateboard) shop (If anyone can remember that?) . I can’t remember much but I recall sweetshop next door; a cafe a bit further along (fond memories of playing “Defender” arcade game there) and further down on the corner was er, a, corner-shop (which probably sold everything). I seem to recall a travel shop and Chinese take-a-way opposite. Across the road from the corner-shop heading towards Peckham was a hardware shop and I think a Butchers right? Would love to know if anyone has any pictures of that era?

  34. Maureen Saunders says:

    I have just discovered a picture of my Dad on this website. I couldn’t believe it as I have never seen this picture before! He is standing alongside George Cooper the Licensee of the Crystal Palace Tavern. The caption refers to him as “a barman”. In fact the barman’s name is Wilfred Bicknell. He must have been in his early twenties before my brother and I were born, Later he started Bicknell’s Coal and his business at 8, Whateley Road,
    East Dulwich where I was born in 1938. I vividly remember all the shops mentioned on this site and have so many happy memories of East Dulwich. I lived there until I married in 1959 and left to start married life in Melbourne Grove. ED. We retired and now live in Barnstaple. Devon. Maureen (Bicknell) Saunders.

  35. John Bown says:

    Wow Maureen you in Barnstable me not to far from Taunton how strangely things turn out Still almost neighbours

  36. John Steel says:

    Born 237 Friern Road in 1948 and lived there till 1970. Went to St. Ann-s school in Melford road (corner with Wood Vale); often played on Dawsons Hill on the way home from school, usually with a friend who lived in Overhill Road. Great times! Many memories of being parked on the step of the Plough with a lemonade while my father was inside! Just remember the trams there. Enjoying reading the comments on this site.

  37. Colin says:

    Hi John
    My sister and husband lived close by you in Friern road
    Derek and Kath Sutton… did you know them ?

  38. Terry davis says:

    The (oil shop)on the corner of Pellat rd and lancroft rd became a doctors surgery his name was dr gunewardene he was Sri Lankan and a brilliant doctor. He saw everyone in the morning and then done his rounds (no telephone appointments then)

  39. Jane saunders nee hannant says:

    What a wonderful site, my name was Jane Hannant, I went to Heber Road School in the 1950s with Christine Taylor, I lived at 317 Underhill Road, Dad was the Barber there. Christine lived next to the Post Office in Crystal Palace road.

    • Doreen says:

      Hi Jane my name was Doreen Butterworth I remember you and Christine I was best friends with Susan Mills still kept in touch with her until January this year when she unfortunately passed away …..Hated my school Days at Heber Road as I wasn’t a fan of Mr Hatton who picked on me on a Daily Basis making my a life a complete Nightmare but luckily enough loved my School Days at Friern Road hope life has been good to you much love Doreen x

  40. Jane saunders says:

    Hi Doreen I remember the name but can’t put a face to it I shall be speaking to Christine this afternoon as she rings me on Sundays. She’s better at remembering things. I’m now widowed with 3 sons and 5 grandchildren ranging in ages 7 to 23 . Christine has 1 daughter ,1 granddaughter,2 great grand children. I used to see mr.Hatton cycling down Townley road on his way to heber when I was walking my son to play school. My memories of heber are making cardboard Tudor houses with mr. Hatton and slab toffee brittle made by a teacher. I now live in petts wood. I’m lucky having good neighbours all who are now widows like me lovely to hear from you love Janex

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